tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20292755.post159024864469953318..comments2024-01-04T02:49:23.470-08:00Comments on Blessing of Kings: Cataclysm Parry: Part IRohanhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/09090769681887119989noreply@blogger.comBlogger16125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20292755.post-70884002719798568462010-12-17T00:21:30.193-08:002010-12-17T00:21:30.193-08:00This change to parry definitely didn't go live...This change to parry definitely didn't go live; 20 seconds of testing will debunk it. Parries still fully avoid attacks, and do nothing to the following swing.Durandalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11340241720384021159noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20292755.post-18190899383978475612010-03-23T13:03:16.693-07:002010-03-23T13:03:16.693-07:00I'll try to find it again, Rohan - but it was ...I'll try to find it again, Rohan - but it was in one of the cataclysm preview threads done by a blue poster, and the example given was fairly clear in the wording that the next non-dodged/missed attack would be parried. Presumably that 'extra' parry wouldn't trigger another chain of parries. From a coding standpoint this is fairly trivial to achieve, and it makes sense from the current hit table as well (no need to stack parry and block, etc). <br /><br />The long and short of it is that this makes parry weaker because of how much dodge you have. GC has confirmed this in another blue post too (when he debated about whether parry or dodge was going to be 'the stat') but at the end of the day, every 1% of dodge or miss you have will reduce your value of parry due to that second parry being dodged/missed.Kalonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05193899462301079034noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20292755.post-65103861714798856342010-03-22T16:30:06.342-07:002010-03-22T16:30:06.342-07:00Hi Rohan,
I probably misread the article (or just ...Hi Rohan,<br />I probably misread the article (or just missed reading a relevant section altogether). But is there a possibility that parry is additive rather than multiplicative? So 100% parry is the same as 100% dodge?<br />I am looking at the following chain of events if parry = 100%<br />Attack 0 - Parry - 50% damage<br />Attach 1 - Parry - 50% damage from previous parry - 50% damage from current attack<br />and so forth..<br />The point being that at the extremes, parry is the same as dodge. In the intermediate points, 10% parry can get you the same effect as 10% dodge (in the absence of any block) - but the variability of damage is lower for parry.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20292755.post-39274387058694932802010-03-20T22:33:05.956-07:002010-03-20T22:33:05.956-07:00Bronte, no, because each Parry only lasts 2 attack...Bronte, no, because each Parry only lasts 2 attacks. Assuming you can "reparry", 100% parry would look like:<br /><br />Atk 0 - Parry1 - 50%<br />Atk 1 - Parry1,Parry2 - 25%<br />Atk 2 - Parry2,Parry3 - 25%<br />Atk 3 - Parry3,Parry4 - 25%<br />...<br /><br />See the pattern. Each Parry Effect only lasts two attacks, so there are only 2 stacked at any one time, for effective 25% damage.Rohanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09090769681887119989noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20292755.post-84864972071168053972010-03-20T17:12:39.573-07:002010-03-20T17:12:39.573-07:00Regarding your last line, wouldn't it be an it...Regarding your last line, wouldn't it be an iteratively lower amount of damage till the amount of damage becomes utterly negligible over time?Brontehttp://arewenewatthis.wordpress.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20292755.post-29830100464870858612010-03-20T06:29:35.587-07:002010-03-20T06:29:35.587-07:00I will refrain from posting while confused. Of cou...I will refrain from posting while confused. Of course you are right, and I'd really love to know what I thought there. Uhm... *hides*Nogamarahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16541775026595839236noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20292755.post-27332895826581912672010-03-19T11:37:25.942-07:002010-03-19T11:37:25.942-07:00With Parry Haste: you parry, next enemy swing is f...<i>With Parry Haste: you parry, next enemy swing is faster. So this is definitely a change to your TTL - for the worse.</i><br /><br />No, no. You parry, *your* next swing is faster. Current Parry has an offensive effect, but no extra effect on TTL.<br /><br />That's why you don't want people attacking the boss from the front. Extra attacks for the boss to parry, extra chances for the boss to speed up.Rohanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09090769681887119989noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20292755.post-18873347809117273182010-03-19T11:30:51.624-07:002010-03-19T11:30:51.624-07:00That's what I wanted to say, actually.
With P...That's what I wanted to say, actually.<br /><br />With Parry Haste: you parry, next enemy swing is faster. So this is definitely a change to your TTL - for the worse.<br /><br />With new Parry: you parry, and parry the next. This also definitely a change to your TTL - just for the better.<br /><br />But nevermind, I was too involved with Hidden Markov Models lately, mixed that up with the "usual" basic Markov chain model.Nogamarahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16541775026595839236noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20292755.post-65018050066384888752010-03-19T10:33:36.659-07:002010-03-19T10:33:36.659-07:00Kalon, do you have a source for that? I haven'...Kalon, do you have a source for that? I haven't seen anything that explicitly says you can Dodge/Miss the second attack.<br /><br />Gevlon, while a Parry Bank (Parry = the next normal hit is reduced by 50%) would work, it is probably excessively complicated. Especially when there are simpler models.<br /><br />Armagon, the new Parry doesn't affect <i>your</i> swings at all. It affects two of <i>enemy's</i> attacks.Rohanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09090769681887119989noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20292755.post-7218424495953495062010-03-19T08:48:58.019-07:002010-03-19T08:48:58.019-07:00Blizzard has said that the parry works like the ma...Blizzard has said that the parry works like the markov model, where if the second attack hits it is reduced by 50%. <br /><br />And parries/blocks don't combine either.<br /><br />So basically you can model the parry effect as giving you a 100% parry chance on the next attack and assume that parry comes after miss and dodge on the attack table, so that the only possible results on the next attack are dodge, parry and miss.<br /><br />Oh yeah - and if the second attack is dodged or miss, the parry chance still goes away.Kalonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05193899462301079034noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20292755.post-71441724286762070582010-03-19T07:46:33.276-07:002010-03-19T07:46:33.276-07:00Could you please elaborate on the part about the M...Could you please elaborate on the part about the Markov model? <br />Because atm I can't see a difference between Parry as hastening your following attack versus giving a bonus to the next swing - just the latter affects the one parrying and the former the one being parried - just on the other side of the pointy stick :PNogamarahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16541775026595839236noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20292755.post-71126111577809097112010-03-19T04:51:44.579-07:002010-03-19T04:51:44.579-07:00Has your model taken account of the fact that as p...Has your model taken account of the fact that as parry increases the value of dodge/block decreases because (if you assume the second attack always hits) then there are fewer incoming hits that can be dodged?<br /><br />It's for this reason that I think the second hit will be able to be avoided, and I think GC hinted as much in a blue post.Everbluehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12047342316034045107noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20292755.post-45228954964789533402010-03-19T01:40:11.571-07:002010-03-19T01:40:11.571-07:00There is also a possibility for "parry bank&q...There is also a possibility for "parry bank", similarly to the fire mages "ignite bank".<br /><br />Every parry makes 2 more swings half. If you parry 5 times in a row, than the first 10 hits will be 50%.<br /><br />This case the damage reduction will be almost linear and equal to dodge until 50% and caps there.Gevlonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07072766785893313616noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20292755.post-3801133833802462002010-03-18T21:37:26.515-07:002010-03-18T21:37:26.515-07:00If I were implementing this system, I would do it ...If I were implementing this system, I would do it in a way that differs from either possibility you have mentioned. For the first boss swing, first check dodge, then if not dodged, parry, if not parried, check block.<br /><br />On the second swing after a parry, I would check dodge, and if not dodged, the attack would be automatically parried as it was following the initial parry, and so neither a parry nor a block roll would be made.<br /><br />I am not predicting that Blizzard will use a system close to what I have outlined here, I am merely saying what I think makes the most sense while making the point that there are way more than two possibilities for them to choose between. With dodge, parry, block, hit, and miss as possible results, and with the options of stacking or not stacking, additive or multiplicative relationships between the probabilities--not to mention the basically infinite additional possibilities for additional wrinkles they could add in if they so choose--i believe you could construct hundreds of models using just the already mentioned elements.Kurthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08064568916740238502noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20292755.post-21843007346374771862010-03-18T20:59:41.314-07:002010-03-18T20:59:41.314-07:00I don't think it will be a stacking % decrease...I don't think it will be a stacking % decrease. I think what you've modeled here is what we'll be seeing.<br /><br />However don't forget that this is the *baseline* damage reduction for a parry. It's very likely that we'll see talents that increase that percentage. Same for the static 30% on blocks - I wouldn't be at all surprised if we found that Prot paladins and warriors get talents to increase that 30% significantly, and it may be that it ends up being a mastery stat.NegativeZerohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13830546868463451029noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20292755.post-79187766685314928372010-03-18T20:48:14.567-07:002010-03-18T20:48:14.567-07:00Sounds like a step in the right direction for redu...Sounds like a step in the right direction for reducing spike damage.Hairymuppethttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08676820269841090509noreply@blogger.com