healers ned to pick up or gtfo, they had easily .04 seconds to toss a life saving heal and they couldn't even be counted on to do that. Ditch those scrubs IMHO
You really need a cooldown rotation after 6 or so stacks. Sucks when your raidleader yells at you for letting the tank die, but unless you start using CDs before Impales, it will happen.
This feature of recount is great - saves a lot of time when trying to work out if a wipe was a) easily avoidable; b) avoidable but unlucky; c) the shit that happens just happend.
No point when I'm leading a raid holding an inquest into a tank death if it was unavoidable.
At least you can be comforted by the fact that your tank's name indicates he has read the super-sweet series of novels by Stephen Erikson. Although, I had trouble understanding why a mage would have 46k health...
DBM tells you about impale over a second before it hits. A disc priest could have tossed a shield and pain suppression. A holy priest could have cast Guardian spirit. Pom would have skimmed a bit of that first hit aswell. All healers could have chosen a different cast when they noticed the impale comming up, all in all this was just bad luck i think, one heal landing only half a second later would have changed that situation. All things you can do about it rely on knowing when an impale will hit though. If you get an unlucky combo you'll see the tank drop like that. No way to respond with reactive healing unless trough pure luck.
I disagree with the "CD rotation" comment. This is not the right tactic. Since Impale hits so hard you should have dedicated rogues who should be worrying about keeping him disarmed all the time. No weapon - no Impale - no crazy damage.
Looking at the damage number in the Recount pic , that's a pretty crazy number. Assuming your tank mitigated 60% of the original blow, that would have placed the incoming damage at 92k. 105k if your tank mitigation is at 65% - Ouch!
I know my guild managed to take Gormok down a week ago (but wiped on the worms) but I wasn't there so I don't know what kind of damage our tanks were taking and there is no combat log parse. Should be interesting to look at WMO or a similar site at parses of other Gormok fights to see the numbers other guilds are seeing.
I believe that disarm doesn't work in Heroic. My guess is they were working on Heroic, as we had many similar tank deaths when we tried it. We were seeing similar kinds of damage even switching at 2 stacks.
To be fair, at that point we didn't have a priest or shaman healing the tanks. I think if we had the Inspiration (-15% physical damage) buff up, the tank would have survived.
You cannot disarm him on heroic difficulty, so you either leave it up to the RNG gods, or you start using cooldowns. Inspiration is only 10% physical damage reduction, but it helps a lot here.
Inspiration won't do the work alone, since you also risk his regular swing timer hitting at the same time. 35k+ Impale, 15k+ bleed and 25k+ regular swing means your tank will die no matter what.
In H-ToC-25, we run it with three tanks switching each two stacks. As I am merely doing damage, I don't listen much but I am hearing holy priests wings being tossed as well as divine protection for the worm tanks when they are done.
Here is our WoL (on damage taken of all our 14 attempts): http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/k6MeaguGy98rHiOs/sum/damageTaken/?enc=bosses&boss=34796
For our guild, we use 2 tanks. Each of them eat 4 stacks and we just heal through it. I'll usually Sacred Shield the first tank, then myself when I tank the boss, to try to soften the blow a little bit.
This is why I feel for the healers. Back when ulduar was "pre nerf" I saw all the damage, and kept thinking, how the hell are they doing it?
Good lord, when is healing going to go from "throw all the damage you can everywhere, including the tanks" to something more fun? I have dual spec holy set, and I pretty much only heal heroics and the occasional naxx run. I don't know how my ulduar healers do it, honestly.
Not a great deal that can be done there - and I feel for the healers. Hopefully nobody bitched.
ReplyDeletehealers ned to pick up or gtfo, they had easily .04 seconds to toss a life saving heal and they couldn't even be counted on to do that. Ditch those scrubs IMHO
ReplyDeleteWhere's that data coming from? Is that an addon or a combatlog analysis site?
ReplyDeleteIt's the addon Recount. If you click someone on the Deaths list, it will show you the last few things that happened to them.
ReplyDeleteIt's quite useful for figuring out exactly what went wrong.
PW:S ftw? >_<
ReplyDeleteYah, this is really a no win situation for those poor healers :(
You really need a cooldown rotation after 6 or so stacks. Sucks when your raidleader yells at you for letting the tank die, but unless you start using CDs before Impales, it will happen.
ReplyDeleteThis feature of recount is great - saves a lot of time when trying to work out if a wipe was
ReplyDeletea) easily avoidable;
b) avoidable but unlucky;
c) the shit that happens just happend.
No point when I'm leading a raid holding an inquest into a tank death if it was unavoidable.
At least you can be comforted by the fact that your tank's name indicates he has read the super-sweet series of novels by Stephen Erikson. Although, I had trouble understanding why a mage would have 46k health...
ReplyDeleteDBM tells you about impale over a second before it hits. A disc priest could have tossed a shield and pain suppression. A holy priest could have cast Guardian spirit. Pom would have skimmed a bit of that first hit aswell. All healers could have chosen a different cast when they noticed the impale comming up, all in all this was just bad luck i think, one heal landing only half a second later would have changed that situation. All things you can do about it rely on knowing when an impale will hit though. If you get an unlucky combo you'll see the tank drop like that. No way to respond with reactive healing unless trough pure luck.
ReplyDeleteWow! Sounds like there's some more quick-reaction cooldown rotations to go on between Healers for this one.
ReplyDeleteI haven't seen Northrend Beasts on Heroic in 25 yet, but I heard it's crazy! :)
I'll keep this in mind for healing assignments when the time comes, however!
Valdesta, Zul'jin-US
My WoW Blog
I disagree with the "CD rotation" comment. This is not the right tactic.
ReplyDeleteSince Impale hits so hard you should have dedicated rogues who should be worrying about keeping him disarmed all the time. No weapon - no Impale - no crazy damage.
Looking at the damage number in the Recount pic , that's a pretty crazy number. Assuming your tank mitigated 60% of the original blow, that would have placed the incoming damage at 92k. 105k if your tank mitigation is at 65% - Ouch!
I know my guild managed to take Gormok down a week ago (but wiped on the worms) but I wasn't there so I don't know what kind of damage our tanks were taking and there is no combat log parse. Should be interesting to look at WMO or a similar site at parses of other Gormok fights to see the numbers other guilds are seeing.
Sucks if it takes you 0.28s to realize your actually dead. :-)
ReplyDelete"No weapon - no Impale - no crazy damage."
ReplyDeleteI believe that disarm doesn't work in Heroic. My guess is they were working on Heroic, as we had many similar tank deaths when we tried it. We were seeing similar kinds of damage even switching at 2 stacks.
To be fair, at that point we didn't have a priest or shaman healing the tanks. I think if we had the Inspiration (-15% physical damage) buff up, the tank would have survived.
ReplyDeleteYou cannot disarm him on heroic difficulty, so you either leave it up to the RNG gods, or you start using cooldowns. Inspiration is only 10% physical damage reduction, but it helps a lot here.
ReplyDeleteInspiration won't do the work alone, since you also risk his regular swing timer hitting at the same time. 35k+ Impale, 15k+ bleed and 25k+ regular swing means your tank will die no matter what.
In H-ToC-25, we run it with three tanks switching each two stacks. As I am merely doing damage, I don't listen much but I am hearing holy priests wings being tossed as well as divine protection for the worm tanks when they are done.
ReplyDeleteHere is our WoL (on damage taken of all our 14 attempts): http://www.worldoflogs.com/reports/k6MeaguGy98rHiOs/sum/damageTaken/?enc=bosses&boss=34796
For our guild, we use 2 tanks. Each of them eat 4 stacks and we just heal through it. I'll usually Sacred Shield the first tank, then myself when I tank the boss, to try to soften the blow a little bit.
ReplyDeleteBit of an undergeared tank issue eh?
ReplyDeleteNot for nothing, but you guys should try Demo Roar, Demo Shout, or Curse of Weakness.
ReplyDeleteThe mob was fully debuffed. We aren't that silly.
ReplyDeleteHoley Moley!
ReplyDeleteThat is crazy damage. WOW!
This is why I feel for the healers. Back when ulduar was "pre nerf" I saw all the damage, and kept thinking, how the hell are they doing it?
Good lord, when is healing going to go from "throw all the damage you can everywhere, including the tanks" to something more fun? I have dual spec holy set, and I pretty much only heal heroics and the occasional naxx run. I don't know how my ulduar healers do it, honestly.
"The mob was fully debuffed. We aren't that silly."
ReplyDelete-----
You verify that on the logs?
Yup. Plus I run the Utopia mod, and we had at least 2 Ret paladins running Vindication.
ReplyDelete