Sunday, July 16, 2006

Horde Edge in PvP

After PvPing for a bit, I've been reconsidering Horde vs. Alliance. I still think that the Horde have a slight advantage when it comes to mobility, and that Paladins are a little too vulnerable to interrupts/fear/shiny distractions. But for the most part, the factions are reasonably balanced against each other in PvP.

However, on average, the Horde are still better than the Alliance. As Horde, I win far more games than I lose. I think that this is because the Horde gets much more practice than the Alliance.

If I'm only on for an hour, as Horde I can get in three to four games. As Alliance, I'm lucky to even get one. So the average Horde gets a lot more practice at the BGs, and thus gets skilled in a faster time than the Alliance. I would estimate that a Horde Rank 6 plays as many games in a week as an Alliance Rank 10+.

As well, the fast queue times allow you to experiment or incorporate new ideas faster. If you have an idea to improve your play, you can instantaneously test it out. If it's a bad idea, and you lose the game, it doesn't matter, because the next game is right around the corner. The feedback cycle is much faster, and thus you can improve your skills faster.

As they say, practice makes perfect.


  1. my personal theory is that this is because most paladins and shamans are nubbiecakes and dont play a hybrid class like they are supposed to. Sure, we can dps, but if we see a rogue going down, we should heal. Most hybrids dont bother to heal in BGs. However, shaman dps>>>than paladin dps, hence the horde has a slight advantage. Paladins in BGs are seen as a mushroom class, something outside rock paper scissors that u can pass and completely ignore

  2. To be fair, it's actually really hard to heal/support if you aren't in the same group. It's hard to judge when to stop attacking and drop a heal.

    Actually, it was unexpected, but the Horde does not start raids in AB/WSG. It's more that everyone just falls into the patterns they've practiced, and acts as a group.

  3. Short post before work... pallies, of course, are the defensive class that can wreak havoc when their cooldowns are up. They can pop a bubble, lay on hands, etc.

    Shamans MIGHT have the edge if they learned to overuse their real game breaker in structured PVP -- the earthbind totem.

  4. That's probably the biggest part. In addition, horde see each other constantly in the BGs, we know our roles. Also, winning more seems to make you more confident, which helps you not secondguess and make the right decisions, which helps you win more, etc. So it is sort of a feedback loop.

    At the beginning playing horde was so much more fun. No one swore at others like happened on the alliance side all the time. People didn't yell at the 0-5s to leave, etc. I think this attitude helped them win. Now our horde pop has grown, and things are worse.

    I also think the alliance pretty races seem to attract people that don't work well in groups. If you get a few of them in your raid, you are toast.

    Alliance used to win all the time on AV on my server, but now Horde is winning maybe 30% and climbing, and we're getting more horde in the battle too, so that an AV pops every day (we used to have AV only a couple times a week!)

    People used to make the excuse for Horde losing AV that Alliance was decked out in purples. But .. well we have more raiders now which helps, Alliance still way outgears us. Yet we are gaining in wins. (funny in wsg and ab, many horde worked together, but not in AV. now i notice horde following directions, and we are winning :) )

  5. I heal in PvP premades. I heal when invited to groups. I do not heal when not in a group because I got tired of hearing rogues bitch all the time "I didn't get healed...". I get tired of hearing that when I've invited them to a group and they decline.

    The horde does have some advantages in that thier racials do tend to lean more toward PvP. And Shamans are just better designed for PvP. It's not an overpowering edge, but it is definitly an edge. Skill counts for more but an even groups the horde will have a small edge.

  6. Skill counts for more but an even groups the horde will have a small edge.

    Maybe that's true, but the constant practice gives the greater edge. Also, Alliance generally outgears the Horde, so that's it's own advantage.

    I honestly think that if the queue times were reversed, the Alliance would be the ones winning all the time.

  7. I honestly think that if the queue times were reversed, the Alliance would be the ones winning all the time.

    I'd tend to disagree with that statement. I've got a 60 on horde side (druid) and a 60 on alliance (pally), and the disparity I notice the most in all battlegrounds is the lack of skill and/or maturity on the Alliance side.

    Don't get me wrong, the alliance teams can and occasionally do do well. But if you (finally) get into a battleground as an alliance character, you just know that there will be at least 1 rogue that tries to solo everything and doesn't listen, 2 NE hunters with variations of the word Legolas, a pally that simply SoC/JoC's every 8 seconds and increasingly a warlock that doesn't understand why his uber-powerful character is dying so often.

    I'm sorry to say, but the average alliance battleground PUG just cannot compete when your group has a median age of 14.